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 It's been a while since I've posted...
Bricks
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
Chicago
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Posts: 222

It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2005 4:26 pm 

... but I had to get on and let the Runworks crowd know I put it all together yesterday in Chicago and came away with a BQ. 3:09:44 and I'm ready for a break. It's been a crazy year since my debut marathon last Chicago (3:37) then New York in November (3:51) then the 27.2 mile debocle that was the Lakeshore Marathon (3:30), but it's been a year I don't think I'll ever be able to top. Now that I have some more time on the horizon, I hope to spend more time on this site which is one of my favorites and see what rickshaw, oldmanrunner, mfox and everyone esle has been up to lately...

Rickshaw
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
San Francisco, CA
Joined: 26 Nov 2004
Posts: 1157

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:10 pm 

Bricks, that's fantastic! Congratulations!!! You must be on top of the world right now.

A crazy year indeed! I'm very impressed that you went from 3:37 to 3:09 in the space of twelve months. Tell us more about the race-- how did it unfold? What was your preparation like going into it? Is there a race report forthcoming?

Will you be running Boston in April 2006 then? Maybe I'll see you there...


mfox

South Orange, New Jersey
Joined: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 367

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:52 pm 

Holy Cow! Great job Bricks! You've progressed in the same fashion that I hope to in the coming year. I'm hoping for a sub 3:00 NYC Marathon (BQ) and then plan to work hard on my speed and stregth. I want to hear all about your recent marathon experience. And more importantly, I want to hear about how you trained this year to improve your time so drastically.

I ran a great New Hampshire Marathon a week ago as a training run for NYC. I'll be posting my marathon report as soon as I get a bit more time to finish it.

Congratulations Bricks...take a 'little' time off but don't lose your edge.


Last edited by mfox on Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:39 pm; edited 2 times in total


Bricks
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
Chicago
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Posts: 222

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 9:26 am 

Thanks guys! I am indeed on cloud nine right now. I still can't believe I did it.

Yes Ricksaw I am going to run this April and Mfox I will be in New York next month (WATCHING!).

Well, I think I mentioned this in some previous conversations, but August 2003, I started running to loose some weight and get in shape, starting with a HALF MILE. Over the next 11 months I went from about 263lbs to 153lbs. I followed Hal Higdon's beginner plans for the half marathon, then the full, maxing out at 40mpw for my first, then overanxiously did New York. I finished out 2004 taking it pretty easy with just the goal of running 1000 miles on the year.

After the new year I got into Higdon's 6 days/week advanced plan for a spring marathon. I wasn't ready for that and half way into the training I hurt my hamstring and IT band on the same leg doing one of his back to back workouts on the weekend (10 pace followed by 17 the next day or something like that) so I scaled things back and did PT to get healthy and just survive Lakeshore's training. I did some very modest speed work at the beginning of that training and maxed out at 48mpw.

After a week off I had exactly 18 weeks to get ready for Chicago, with Boston on my brain. I ditched Hal for Pete Pfitzingerís Advanced Marathoning book. I followed his 18 week 55mpw or less plan, just about to the letter. I found I loved the mesocycle approach. I was determined to stay healthy this training. I raced only once. I religiously followed the easy-hard rule. I never ran 6 days. And I did all the runs the way he described them, and when. For the first time, I did my warm-ups and cool downs. I did the strides. I did recovery runs at a recovery pace. I tracked my heartrate AND listened to what it told me. I did my tempo runs and intervals at the recommended pace, not slower, not faster. I did my long runs with a group that usually did 7:35ís to 7:45ís. The plan called for 3-20ís. That was the one thing I changed. I did a 21 and a 22 primarily for psychological reasons. I also did one very hilly 17 miler while I was on vacation, but otherwise I followed the plan to the letter. I maxed out at I think 58 mpw and came in with 1500 miles year to date under me. I tapered the way he said, no more no less. I trusted the plan. The summer here was extremely hot. It made for some really tough months of training.

On race day it was a perfect low 50ís. I chose to wear the new Brooks Adrenaline 6ís in lieu of the 5ís Iíd run in for the last year plus. They were an ounce lighter after all. I dawned a singlet for the first time in race. I was looking for every slight advantage I could think of. I didnít want one of those decisions to cost me precious seconds. I left the heartrate monitor at home, this one I was running with my gut. My plan was to run even EFFORT splits, where the early miles are slightly faster than pace and you gradually slow as you fatigue, so that every mile Ďfeelsí the same. My plan was to stay near 45 minute 10kís. The math was easy.

When the horn blew, I eased into a pace I thought I could maintain and give me a chance. I figured, I might as well go out strong and worst case I canít hang on. I wanted to leave everything out on the course. I crossed the start :45 seconds after the start, I would be able to use the race clocks, Iíd just chase 03:10:00. I felt GREAT early. 7:06, great. 7:02, I thought I slowed down! then I caught sight of a guy from my training group up ahead, I wanted to catch him and run with him, 6:55, thatís okay I feel fine, it will be worth it to catch AJ. 6:57, got him. 7:02, 7:07, 7:03, 7:05, weíre in a rhythm. 7:12, 7:02, 7:10, 7:19 that last gu didnít sit well. 7:11. Halfway home I was at 01:33:04, a half-marathon PR for me. Am I too fast? Stick to the plan, my legs feel great, my breathing is easy. We have more than 2 minutes to play with AJ said. 7:16, 7:09, 7:25 uh oh, mile 16, am I fading? 7:26, I am fading. 7:23, hang on. 7:18, better. 7:25 mile 20, help is on the way. AJ, running his first marathon was laboring, he couldnít stay with me. But he got me so far, just far enough actually. At the risk of compromising my beliefs about bandits, my co-worker Doug, a very talented runner and a 3 time Boston Qualifier (all three of his marathons, including at Boston) had volunteered to run with me from mile 20 to 25.2. I told him, only if Iím close. We agreed heíd focus as much on me as he would on staying out of otherís way and he carried Gatorade for himself (and me) and not use the aid stations and that he would not go close to the finish line. Thank god for Doug. I was able to breeze past aid stations. I was able to ignore my splits and just run with him, just focus on him, not my pace. 7:27, the official 3:10 pace group just passed me, oh no, Iíve lost it, I canít stay with them. Doug wasnít going to have me go down on his watch. He screamed, not acceptable, letís go, stride out and catch that pack up there, letís goÖ. I didnít question, I just did what he said, I just ran, no matter how much it hurt. 7:07, woah that might save me or kill me. 7:17, hang on 5K to go, just hang on, somehow. 7:25, 7:29 I have nothing left. Doug did the math then and gave me the news. Youíve got it Scott, he said. Iíll see you at the recovery tent. I was at the 25.2 sign. I looked at the clock, I looked at my watch. I remembered I wanted to be there at 3:03:00. I read 03:01:05. I did have it! I just needed to not pass out, just finish. On the final straightaway my eyes were glued to the clock. I couldnít believe it. 03:10:30 clock time over my head as I crossed, 03:09:44 on my watch. No one could take it away. I had nothing left, I wanted to collapse. I was choked up, and elated at the same time. The first thing I thought, oddly enough, was Iím never doing a gu again. Somehow I held down 4 of them, they messed with me every long run I tried them, but I suspect I needed every one of them this day. In the end, every little thing fell in to place, I had that perfect race day, that so few marathoners get to say theyíve had. It couldnít have been better timing.


mfox

South Orange, New Jersey
Joined: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 367

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:52 pm 

Wow! That was great! Really enjoyed your description of your race. I'm not expecting to do any better than a 3:28 (need 3:30 for BQ) at NYC this year. My recovery from Plantar Fasciitis has held me back from getting a good start this year. I've dropped from 225lbs to 195lbs (I ran NYC at about 210lbs last year) and know I could stand to lose another 15-20lbs (I"m 6' tall). You've inspired me to set my sights high for next spring or fall.

Rickshaw
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
San Francisco, CA
Joined: 26 Nov 2004
Posts: 1157

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 8:51 pm 

Wow, awesome report. That is really outstanding. This may be one of the few times in your life when you can feel really proud of yourself without feeling like a jerk about it. :-) That is an awesome accomplishment, and I'm sure you'll never forget the feeling. 3:09-- I'm jealous!!!

It sounds like your friend Doug was a real lifesaver when it came to mile 20 and beyond. So much of the experience is mental at that point, it's not enough to merely be physically fit. I'm glad you held it all together and finished strong. A certain degree of horn-tooting is definitely in order!


Bricks
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
Chicago
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Posts: 222

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 11:17 am 

Thanks guys!

yeah, mfox, it's crazy what a couple pounds difference feels like out there. i will be out there cheering you on in november, you'll have to put "mfox" on your shirt or something though...

yeah, sorry if that came off a little egocentric... i was a bit excited.... Doug was indeed a lifesaver, i dare say i would have faded and missed it if he weren't there. i owe him big time. yeah, i think it's more mental than physical. of course without the fitness it's impossible, but even with it, it's impossible if you're not in the right mindset...

rickshaw, speaking of having people to run with.... what are you plans for boston? how fast are you aiming for? is anyone else you know running? at the very least it'd be nice to maybe meet up in hopkington to pass the time before the race... i've heard that's a lot worse than new york with the bus trip out there, then waiting till the late morning to go...


mfox

South Orange, New Jersey
Joined: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 367

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:57 pm 

Hanging around before the Boston start isn't too bad. It's not isloated to just the runners like NYC is (at least it wasn't in 2001). There are a lot of vendors (food, merchandise) and people hanging out with their family. If you know something about the start area or the "athletes village" (at the High School down the road) you can designate a meeting spot easily enough. A bunch of the folks who post on CoolRunning.com did that at the Vermont Marathon.

Bricks, how did you lose so much weight? Did you rely on more than a sensible diet and running? I've been losing weight slower than I lwould like mainly because it's tough to run well and watch what I eat at the same time. I can't simply choose to cut back calories, because then it's harder to run at the necessary intensity or length of time and so my training suffers.


Rickshaw
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
San Francisco, CA
Joined: 26 Nov 2004
Posts: 1157

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:11 pm 

Bricks wrote:
rickshaw, speaking of having people to run with.... what are you plans for boston? how fast are you aiming for? is anyone else you know running? at the very least it'd be nice to maybe meet up in hopkington to pass the time before the race...

We should definitely meet to say hi if nothing else. I have a lot of friends in Boston (I used to live there), so I may get someone to drop me in Hopkinton closer to race time, rather than spending the morning in the athlete's village. Although I hear that's half the fun. I have no real time goal at the moment, since I'm mostly just trying to get back in shape. Probably I'll be aiming for something like 3:20-ish, but that's just a guess.

And I didn't mean to imply that your race report was overly egocentric. What I meant was: you deserve to feel proud of yourself!


Rickshaw
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
San Francisco, CA
Joined: 26 Nov 2004
Posts: 1157

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:17 pm 

mfox wrote:
I've been losing weight slower than I lwould like mainly because it's tough to run well and watch what I eat at the same time. I can't simply choose to cut back calories, because then it's harder to run at the necessary intensity or length of time and so my training suffers.

What kind of mileage have you been running? I've always found that I lost a few pounds during marathon training, even though I almost certainly ate more. I was just burning so many calories! My only "trick" for weight loss is to substitute water for other beverages. It's amazin how many calories you can consume in a day from juices and soda and such.

Right now I'm at about 144 pounds (at 5'11" height), which is only about 5 pounds more than my lowest weight achieved during peak training last summer. My wife keeps telling me I need to gain wiehgt, so I don't pay too much attention to how much I eat, although I'm always conscious of what kinds of food I eat. I've been vegetarian for 10 years, and generally try to avoid most kinds of processed foods. I don't know if it actually makes a difference, but I feel better about myself.


mfox

South Orange, New Jersey
Joined: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 367

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 1:23 pm 

I've been putting in about 50 mpw with a max of 60. I played football in HS and College and have always been heavy. My goal is to get to about 189 for NYC and an ultimate goal of 175-180 by spring. And if I can get lighter it'll be a big plus. SInce my PF has kept me from developing my workout intensity to the level I woudl like, I've been relying on the weight loss to make up the difference. I don't think I've ever run a marathon lighter than 195. I tried the low carb diet last fall and managed to lose 14lbs in two weeks but I became very grumpy and my legs felt like crap during my runs. So...needless to say, that didn't last long...but it gave me a good start my weight loss.

Bricks
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
Chicago
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Posts: 222

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:07 pm 

mfox,

i did quite a number of things. sufficed to say i was extremely unhealthy before so a lot of little things made a huge difference. running was central, needless to say. i ran 4-5 times a week, starting around 5 miles a week, building up to 40 (about when the pounds leveled off). I did not believe in low carb as a effective long term solution, i mean fruit has carbs, how can that make sense, and i wanted to have energy to run.... My diet was inspecific and self-invented, but here are some things i did:

-I started eating breakfast for the first time in my life, something small, like a bagel or fruit and granola bar and coffee.
-I ate a very square lunch and this was my big meal of the day.
-During my early weightloss, when my mileage was low, my dinner was the number of calories my run was. so, if i ran 3 miles, my dinner was 300 calories. Later on, this became impossible to maintain.

-NO POP! I cut out soda, period. INCLUDING DIET, trust me, i don't care if it doesn't have any calories, it's bad for you.
-Minimize sugar. Sugar has sooo many calories
-WAY Less drinking. Once a week at most, and no more 10 drink binges-it's not called a beer belly for nothing.
-No fried foods or processed meats or obviously greasy food.
-Eat as many fruits and veggies as possible all day long. I never counted these calories, they're mostly good ones anyway and it kept me from getting hungry and overeating.


Last edited by Bricks on Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:12 pm; edited 1 time in total


Bricks
Runworks 2005 5M Racer
Chicago
Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Posts: 222

Re: It's been a while since I've posted... Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:10 pm 

yes, let's definitely hook up in some fashion!

ok cool, some guys at the office were jokingly telling me to stop bragging right around when i read that, so i didn't know if i was coming off like i was bragging too much...


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